A few years ago I had a natural aversion to the little commie guns that shoot the 7.62 x 39 cartridge. Then, over the past few years it's become obvious that the AK and SKS rifles - and all the copies were the most prevalent guns in the United States save of maybe the AR family of weapons. Even then, I'm not so sure.
In the course of this thread, I'm not going to try and reinvent the wheel. I am going to share with you my research and give you the most authoritative and reliable links that I know of. If you have an SKS or AK... or considering one for your collection and / or MBR, this information will be more than valuable. So, let's get started:
I was in a gun shop today and spotted three boxes of 7.62 39 ammo in yellow boxes (Norinco.) Until today I had always thought that those yellow boxes meant steel core ammo. I asked the clerk if it was AP and he claimed not to know. Had he been a regular at that store, I'd have called B.S. on his "not knowing" right away. Anyway, SOMETIMES when these guys buy out a warehouse full of stuff from storage, they don't know what they have, but rest assured NO gun dealer will sell you AP ammo for the 7.62 x 39. But, it was yellow boxed and an inexperienced receiving clerk could have made a mistake.
The three boxes were priced at $5.99 each and now I'm REAL curious. So I got the clerk to open the box (BTW, it had been priced at $4.99 by the previous store, Sportstown.) The bullet part stuck to a magnet (albeit a bit weakly) so I really DON'T know about it. Then, I found the date to be "93 manufacture.
That's when I came home a few minutes ago and began researching all about those yellow boxes. Turns out, even if you get NEW Norinco in the yellow box, it may NOT be steel core. Here's a link to the information I found out about it:
I wanted to start with the ammo first as I have a lot to say about ammo and the AK / SKS rifles, but if you happen to be in the market for an AK, I knew that the U.S. Navy SEALs train with the Norinco MAK90. So, knowing that, I wanted to give them a plug first. As soon as I researched the ammo, I decided that I'd start this thread and leave you with the equivalent of a reputable Consumer Reports article on the AK and variants, so start with this link:
I happen to have a soft spot for quite a few of the soviet weapons. I bought a 9mm Makarov brand new w/2 clips for $115 tax included (several years ago) it has never jammed and is accurate enough for me to shoot a possum out of a tree from about 40 ft.
The AK is in my mind the perfect weapon for "Urban Warfare". It can stand up to the neglect of the non professional and fire under the most adverse conditions. Any type of conflict that we are likely to experience in the near future will be of the urban variety.
As a side note, I read something a few years ago concerning the CHICOMS. They consider the South to be of great concern due to the mentality of and the amount of weapons and the proportion of veterans to the genpop when compared to the rest of the states. I took it to mean that when they do decide to invade................they will not come through the south first.
As a toolmaker............I have built bending jigs to fold receivers for home built AK's. All perfectly legal.
I like the AK and SKS. I have one that a lot of AK guys dont care for. Mine is a WASR-10 Hi Cap and I have had no problems with it. The gun goes bang everytime.
I am in the process of doing an AR build that I hope to have done some day. I just need the upper now with the lower parts kit and Im ready to go.
Not much I can say about ammo anymore its all going up in price. I to own a Makarov copy and the ammo is crazy around here for it. I think I can find a box of 50 12-14 bucks.
How hard is it to bend the flats for an AK. I have looked at doing a parts gun but found it cheaper to buy a complete gun. I want an under folder but have not found one yet localy.
Also on a side note if you have an AK aims is running a good deal on mags right now 9.99ea or (I think) 3 or more 7.99ea. I wanted to buy some more but until I finsh my AR prject its a no go. I have 9 mags for the AK and 8 for the AR.
Im also getting some books that have been sugested to me for reading. Im hoping after paying for class this coming fall I will be able to buy the upper for the AR if not back on my wish list.
Unless you have access to a machine shop or you can weld, the build it yourself AK is not very cost efficient unless you are building a half dozen rifles.
You have to get a bending jig and several other tools that cost about $250. And then you'll STILL need access to bending equipment.
If you decide to buy registered receivers, then you may as well buy the whole weapon. It's cheaper. And while you can get entire kits to keep your AK up, the use of a lot of the surplus parts may classify your rifle as a machine gun under BATFE rules. Factually I don't know what you can use and what you can't.
The AR is easier to build, but it also a less reliable firearm... HOWEVER, you can reload for it, making the issue of ammo a factor in the AR's favor. Check this out:
Hi Enforcer your right on the AK its a lot cheaper to buy a full gun already done. I guess a lot of people still build them to have fun doing it. I wanted to see if it was cheaper for me to do one and well it isnt.
My AR project is going to be around 595-610 to build. I have found some new 30 round mags that I bought four of them for 9.99ea. I also found some good used ones in my area no tax and no shipping on that I paid just under 9 bucks for four of them.
I think for me its better to build the AR and buy the AK. I do want to start stocking up on ammo.
I have a gift card to walmart and so far the cheapest ammo there is for my 9mm. I cant belive that .223 or 7.62x39 is a little over a dollar a round. I think a box of 20 is like 24 bucks. The net has the best deals on ammo and if my cousin goes and buys the AK he has been looking at we can do a group buy on AK and AR ammo.
I also want to get a few more mags for my AK and I think AIMS has them for 9.99ea or three or more for 7.99ea.
Im hoping over my summer break I can work on making my chest rigs for my AK mags. Im in the design process of it right now and then I will be sewing it up.
According to the Navy SEALs, the MAK 90 is the best stamped receiver AK on the market, the closest thing to a real AK made.
The problem for me is that thumbhole stock is butt ugly. I looked into replacing it, but found replacement stocks to be slim pickings.
With a little elbow grease, the Tapco stock is supposed to fit the MAK 90. But when I looked at the customer reviews on places like Cheaperthandirt.com and so forth, they didn't have much respect for the Tapco stock. Some people didn't like to cut a stock to fit the AK receiver; some thought the stock was too short (which is good if you're near midget size); the worst complaint was the el cheapo built in sling swivel - which reviewers said was a piece of wire made into the stock which breaks off easily.
So, between trying to figure out what the magic number of U.S. parts must be put into the AK before you can put a modern U.S. stock on it and the lack of quality stocks, I'm just checking in to see if anyone out there has any ideas on updating a MAK 90. Or should I start looking for an AK Norinco Legend (preban of course)?
Funny that you should post on this. I happen to have a MAK90 and have installed the folding stock & grip from TAPCO. I love it. You may have to do a slight bit of trimming where the stock goes into the receiver, but this is WAYYYY better than that pos thumbhole stock that it came with. I would imagine that most of the whiners on CTD don't have the ability to think a little and make it work. I have also installed the TAPCO SKS stock on my SKS and it's the SH*T. With the new and improved TAPCO 20 rnd detachable mags it's a hands down winner !! Yes I had to do a little modification on that too, but it's not that difficult. TAPCO makes great products and I have not had ANY issues with anything I have bought from them. You can still order from them until Dec 31st 08, but starting Jan 09 they are only selling wholesale, no more online ordering directly from them. Anyone that has bought from them in the past should have received an email from them stating this new policy.
Better get what you need NOW before Obama bin Laden and Biden become the new Socialist leaders and ban the hell out of everything. _________________ " We will die on our feet before we live on our knees"
Francis Scott Key
Not everybody is the mechanical genuis that Phoenix is. Remember that if he makes a project sound simple. Hell, most of us here have ten thumbs and don't want to butcher a new stock, trying to make it fit.
Me personally, I don't like the look of the collapsible stocks, etc. I want one of those synthetic stocks like the newer AKs are fitted with. These stock sets usually run around a hundred bucks. However, the people buying the cheaper Tapco stock claim that the sling swivel is a POS and breaks if you actually use it. I just wonder how those other stocks hold up? And one last thing:
The left is sounding pro militia these days. I found the following thread while looking for AK stocks via Google. You won't believe this until you read it:
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The left is sounding pro militia these days. I found the following thread while looking for AK stocks via Google. You won't believe this until you read it:
hahahahahahaha.......ROFLMAO.......Thanks for the link. I went there and read the posts.. I don't think 2 monkeys effing a football would be as funny as watching those limp wristed liberals trying to get their act together. That was good !!! _________________ " We will die on our feet before we live on our knees"
Francis Scott Key
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